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- Theory on the Ancestry of Mary Norris Allerton of the Mayflower and John Norris, b. 1617 of Roxbury, Mass, and Suffolk Co., NY Based upon Many DNA Triangulations between Descendants of Each Including Documentation. However, these triangulations are on chrome 15 from 27,000,000-29,000,000 right where I also have many triangulations with likely ancestors of Mary Saunders. I do not know which family the DNA is from. Both families are on my father's side and they are triangulating with each other is some cases.
If you are a descendant of Mary Norris Allerton and have done any research at all, you know that there are many guesses as to her English ancestry. Most commonly she is listed as the daughter of Sir Edward Norris, Gov. of Ostend, whose home was in Berkshire, England. According to Wikitree, “On 17 Jul 1600 he married Mrs Elizabeth Webb at Englefield, Berkshire. [1]
The ODNB article … says "His nephew Francis [q. v.] succeeded to his estates. His wife Elizabeth, by whom he had no issue, was the rich widow of one Webb of Salisbury…The history of parliament biography also agrees that his heir was his nephew.” If their marriage had produced a legitimate heir, his estates would have been inherited by his eldest son. If there were no sons, then it would have gone to his eldest daughter by law. The fact that his estates went to his nephew confirms that he had no legitimate heirs. That means if Mary was his daughter, she would have been illegitimate.
I have a better theory worked upon diligently from a new lead. I discovered that my distant connection to a cousin was through the Norris on chromosome 15. It matched the same segments from approximately 27,000,000 to 29,000,000 that matched her other Norris cousins who descended through John Norris, b. 1617 of England, Bermuda, Massachusetts, and New York. That told us that my ancestor, Mary Norris Allerton of the Mayflower was related to John Norris who died in Suffolk Co., NY. Neither’s ancestry is known with certainty.
We had another clue to help. Mary Norris said she was from Newbury, (Berkshire), England in her marriage to Isaac Allerton in 1611 in Leiden, Holland. If she was from Newbury, what family of Norris’ lived nearby? One of them was the Sir Edward above. He lived about 32 miles from her in Englefield, Berkshire, England. However, there were better choices. The closest Norris family was of Yattenden Castle in Berkshire which was only 7 miles from Newbury.
I combed all the possible baptismal records for both Mary Norris b. somewhere in the 1580’s and John Norris b. 1617. I used Freereg.org.uk and the baptismal records of England and Wales. There was only one somewhat close to Newbury for a Mary. This was for a Mary Norris baptized on Oct. 30, 1580 in Caddington, Bedfordshire, England which was 50+ miles by the way the crow flies away from Newbury. She was the daughter of Richard and Alice Dermer Norris who married in Caddington a year prior to her birth. This is earlier than people thought she was born but still within the normal childbearing years in which she had her children. A Richard Norris was born in Reading, England in 1542. Reading was only 20 miles from Newbury, England. He was one of 3 who could be her father. One of them was born in 1541 of Sandy, Bedfordshire, England (which was 75 miles from Newbury) and was the son of William Norris.
The other two were b. in 1542 in Reading, Berkshire, England also. They are as follows:
View 1
Rich: NORRIS Baptism 09 Nov 1542 Berkshire Reading : St Mary : Unspecified
View 2
Richard NORRIS Baptism 22 Dec 1542 Berkshire Reading : St Mary : Unspecified
This is a weak link in this theory. I have assumed her father was one of the Richards of Reading, Berkshire, England, whose father’s first name was not provided. Why did I choose this? We have autosomal DNA triangulations with descendants of John Norris, b. 1617 who is likely to have an ancestor who is quickly related to Mary Norris of the Mayflower. Autosomal triangulations back this far do no occur unless the family married cousins to keep the wealth in the family in Eurooe. It’s my assumption that it’s Mary’s father or grandfather that she and John Norris of Mass. and NY have in common. It’s also my assumption that this ancestry would take them back to the Berkshire Norris’ to account for Mary giving her residence as Newbury before coming to Leiden, Holland where she married.
Next let’s look at John’s ancestry. There is only one John born in 1617 in baptismal records that I’ve found near Berkshire. He too was baptized in Bedfordshire, England on Feb. 28, 1617/1618. This was in Steppingley and his father was Andrew. Andrew was baptized on 20 Apr 1585 and was the son of John.
John Norris appears to have been baptized in Reading, Berkshire, England on Oct 9, 1546! John was the likely son of John Norris and Catherine Nicholes who married there in 1538. It’s the only Norris family that shows up in the Reading marriage records at that time. The surname Nicholes got passed down as a first name in this family with the spelling of Nicholas. I cannot find a baptismal record for John. He would likely have been born before 1518.
Who could Richard (father of Mary) and John b. bef. 1518 be the son of? The Norris who owned the Castle in Yattenden was Sir John, b. 1484 at the time that both men would have been born. It is a theory that these two related Norris families of the colonies were descended from Sir John. We can really only surmise that this is one possible path and that Mary Norris of the Mayflower and John Norris b. 1617 of Mass. and NY are children of Sir John or his ancestors. It’s a possible path that takes existing documents into account with the added advantage of DNA triangulations. Each triangulation represents 3 cousins who inherited DNA on chromosome 15 from common Norris ancestors. Triangulations are the gold standard for autosomal DNA proof.
I hope that one day, YDNA will prove that John Norris is related to this Yattenden, Berkshire, England group. Until then, we can most certainly be finding more autosomal triangulations and possibly documents that can support or refute this theory.
Linda Coate
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1542 - 1600 (58 years)
